First-Class Cross-Border Accounting with Katrina Nacci

00:00:00:01 - 00:00:15:04

Katrina Nacci

And we see these guys bobbing around in their boat heads up. They were going to get frostbite, so we all rallied to pull them ashore. One of the guys was like moving on to a cooler full of beer. He didn't want to let go of the cooler, really, to tell you to let go because you're not going to survive.

00:00:15:07 - 00:00:20:01

Katrina Nacci

We actually ended up getting a Coast Guard reward for that. My name is Katrina Nacci.

00:00:20:15 - 00:00:26:15

Daniëlle Keeven

When she's not saving lives in the water. Katrina makes a name for herself in a cross-border accounting advisory space.

00:00:26:21 - 00:00:34:19

Katrina Nacci

Helping European companies go public in the US, helping U.S. companies acquire European companies, and off the accounting nuances that go along with that.

00:00:34:21 - 00:00:39:22

Daniëlle Keeven

Understanding these nuances comes from real world experience. Having worked with businesses across the globe.

00:00:40:03 - 00:00:47:19

Katrina Nacci

I spent three years in Boston and I was in Germany for two or three years and moved to Dubai, and now I've been back in Germany.

00:00:47:19 - 00:00:50:17

Daniëlle Keeven

Join us as we learn about a devastating life of Katrina.

00:00:50:18 - 00:00:58:15

Katrina Nacci

Nancy, it's like almost knowing what you don't know when it comes to educating other CFR, what's really possible with the resources that you have.

00:00:59:03 - 00:01:29:19

Daniëlle Keeven

My name is Danielle. Kevin. Let's uncover the head stories of finance professionals as they navigate money, investment and growth. Let's look into the person behind the CFO title. Let's go beyond the budget before we get into the episode. If you enjoyed the show, please leave a five star review of the podcast wherever you listen. It helps out the whole panel studios team tremendously and lets us continue to uncover the hidden stories of CFOs.

00:01:33:08 - 00:01:46:08

Daniëlle Keeven

Katrina's current life abroad doesn't exactly match the childhood she experienced. While trips to Europe were moments she cherished deeply. Listen on to hear about her grounded upbringing and how that shaped her values today.

00:01:47:03 - 00:02:04:05

Katrina Nacci

My I grew up in Rhode Island, which is like an hour from Boston. It's the smallest state in the U.S., but it's got a long coastline. It's very beautiful place. I mean, I have like a tiny two in bed that you see all these like movies and stuff of kids growing up. And they had these big queen and king beds.

00:02:04:07 - 00:02:21:22

Katrina Nacci

Like, who are these people? I mean, I enjoyed it. I mean, space for a desk. I was kind of nerdy, so I was always sitting in there. Do you remember? I can't specifically remember posters. I remember that it was purple. I mean, posters back in the day probably would have been like Hansen and and say, Yeah, that's all I can really remember.

00:02:21:22 - 00:02:47:16

Katrina Nacci

I mean, I spent the first eight years of my life there, so I had a very steady childhood home, actually. Funny enough, my mom is in the process of moving back into that house, which I haven't seen in like over ten years. So it's going to be a really weird thing for me to go back and do. I mean, I think there's a lot of value in having a stable childhood where your parents are like invested in your education and you really have like a good relationship and can talk openly about that stuff.

00:02:47:17 - 00:03:10:16

Katrina Nacci

What's kind of been interesting for me is I kind of like sneak in that and let it a little bit. I mean, nothing to do with like being close to my parents, but more just having one place where I was for the first 18 years of my life. Because after graduating college, I spent three years in Boston and then I moved to Germany and I was in Germany for two or three years and moved to Dubai for two years.

00:03:10:16 - 00:03:26:14

Katrina Nacci

And now I've been back in Germany for almost five years. So like this is now the longest. I live consistently in one place, but it's just kind of interesting to contrast that with my childhood, which is just all in one place. And now I'm kind of like bopping around and I feel very settled down now. But it was just interesting that I felt the need to like, get out and explore.

00:03:26:14 - 00:03:35:20

Katrina Nacci

And luckily having my parents close that, like traveling internationally when I was younger, I think allowed me kind of the comfort and security and confidence in myself to be able to do that.

00:03:36:07 - 00:03:50:19

Daniëlle Keeven

With my mom. Katrina's travels abroad weren't the only kinds of journeys she would take. Next, we hear about her life growing up on the water, including one life saving experience that resulted in Katrina and her family being awarded by the U.S. Coast Guard.

00:03:51:20 - 00:04:10:01

Katrina Nacci

My dad is an all weather sailor and will be the first one out during the season and the last one. And we went to pick up one of the new boats that we had bogged down in Connecticut. And I remember sitting on the morning of the boat, which is not a dock, but like when there's like a little boy in the water that you grab and all of a sudden I guess there was like a tornado, all landers little.

00:04:10:05 - 00:04:27:10

Katrina Nacci

And the boat started like spinning around in circles. So it's kind of crazy. And another time you were out very early in the season, it was maybe March or April, and so there weren't a lot of other boats on the bay and were coming back to shore. And we see these guys bobbing around and their boat had sunk.

00:04:27:10 - 00:04:44:20

Katrina Nacci

They went out fishing or something and there were three older guys and I mean, they were going to get frostbite and minutes or hours, I mean, it was very cold. So we all kind of like rallied and had different tasks to like keep an eye on them and like pull them ashore, get them warm again. One of the guys, he was like holding on to a cooler full of beer.

00:04:44:20 - 00:04:59:13

Katrina Nacci

He didn't want to let go of the cooler. We're like, Dude, you need to let go because you're not going to survive. Then we called like the Coast Guard in the ambulance and stuff, and they came. When we dock, they came and we actually ended up getting a Coast Guard reward for that. But it was a pretty hairy situation.

00:05:03:09 - 00:05:13:00

Daniëlle Keeven

Next, we'll hear about where the itch for Katrina to immerse herself in new cultures came from as she tells it. Family vacations weren't as easy as a plan back in the day.

00:05:14:02 - 00:05:32:10

Katrina Nacci

My mom was definitely more on the adventurous side. She was the one that was always planning all these trips. So when I was in sixth grade, we did two weeks in Italy and then eighth grade, two weeks in France, and then 11th grade or 10th grade, two weeks in Spain. So we have a decent amount of time in each place and got to see different cultures.

00:05:32:10 - 00:05:51:05

Katrina Nacci

And I mean, back in the day, this was like 2000 or 1998, whatever. We did our first international trip. So I mean, she was going on Airbnb like herself out. I mean, she was back seeing, calling places. It was a very different level of effort that went into planning those trips. But I just really enjoyed like seeing different cultures, kind of learning bits and pieces of the language.

00:05:51:05 - 00:06:09:11

Katrina Nacci

We would spend time, you know, around the dinner table for the month leading up to the trip, kind of like learning phrases together as a family that was just really interesting. And I kind of always wanted to go back and explore that by myself. I mean, even when I was there with my family, I was trying to figure out how to navigate on the different like local subway and stuff.

00:06:09:11 - 00:06:11:06

Katrina Nacci

So just really enjoyable.

00:06:14:06 - 00:06:29:07

Daniëlle Keeven

With her thrilling familial adventures in the rearview mirror, it was time for Katrina to focus on her education. It took a lot of grit to head in the direction Katrina desired. And as you'll hear next, she started her education in a field you might not expect.

00:06:32:01 - 00:06:52:04

Katrina Nacci

Yes, I was originally in a technical institute up in upstate New York for biochemistry and biophysics, just like a lot harder than other, expecting it to be. I really enjoyed it, but just some of the concepts, it was a little too abstract for me at some points, and so I wanted to do something that was like a little bit more and no ground stepping reality, I guess.

00:06:52:12 - 00:07:15:19

Katrina Nacci

I don't know. That's a very good way to put it. But I realized that what I enjoyed was more like the math and the logic behind the science and learned to kind of pivot in a different direction. So I decided to transfer back home to the University of Rhode Island, and I was initially double majoring in applied math and finance, but I took an accounting class and had to do some case study around P.W see, and I was like, Oh, I want to work there.

00:07:15:19 - 00:07:41:08

Katrina Nacci

But it was much easier to get into the Big Four as an accounting major. So I actually switched from finance to accounting almost entirely for that purpose because I could see a very concrete path forward as an accounting major. So that's what kind of ultimately led me there. I think just starting to see that end goal of like, this is what I want to be after college, like the ambitions that I was starting to develop to like move into a big city and go into the big four.

00:07:41:08 - 00:08:05:22

Katrina Nacci

I could see it happening and that really made me want to fight for it. It was difficult because as a transfer student and you are, I didn't automatically qualify for scholarships initially, which looking back on it, it was very difficult because if I had applied as a high school senior, I would have gotten a full ride because I was a in-state person and had decent enough grades, was able to like get into the honors program and then get some scholarships as a result.

00:08:05:22 - 00:08:24:00

Katrina Nacci

But it never made up the full thing. So I was still working the job that I had since high school, which was at a yacht club, actually. But I moved into the office there, so I was starting to get accounting experience even at the yacht club. And then I also was Dad manager for a beach club in Rhode Island, which was the most fun job.

00:08:24:00 - 00:08:34:19

Katrina Nacci

I just kind of sat on the beach and managed the lifeguards and top the members. And then I was also the business manager for the school newspaper, which is fun and also kind of more hands on. You got to learn how to use QuickBooks and all that fun stuff.

00:08:37:18 - 00:08:58:09

Daniëlle Keeven

All of this vocational experience would pay off for Katrina and she would next take the CPA exam. She finished school and then started her career at BW. See, she got an average score of 96 on all four parts of the CPA exam, which is pretty impressive. But as you'll hear next, she was just a touch shy from a lucrative reward.

00:09:01:01 - 00:09:23:11

Katrina Nacci

I think I went about it the right way and I always advocate people to do that. So I graduated in May and I didn't start working until September, which is pretty typical on the accounting world. You'll get a job offer way ahead of time. I got it like the October before, so I knew I had like three months where I wasn't doing anything for my I'm just going to put my head down and study and get them out of the way.

00:09:23:11 - 00:09:39:09

Katrina Nacci

So I took like and they have different windows, which I can't even remember now. Like one month was blacked out and then you had like July and August. The testing was open and so I would take two each month and I was literally just studying 10 hours a day, seven days a week. I had actually moved up to Boston.

00:09:39:09 - 00:09:54:23

Katrina Nacci

I was like subletting a place because the idea was I was going to go into Boston College and they have a prep class every day. But I just got the agenda for the class and I did like the self-study, so I didn't bother to like commute back and forth and I was just doing it on my own. So it was a kind of lovely time.

00:09:55:02 - 00:10:15:08

Katrina Nacci

And I remember going out a couple of nights of going to some Red Sox games during the process, but it was really just like heads down studying and in retrospect, like I probably over study because you really only need a 75 on that. It doesn't matter. But I did find out at some point after that because if you get I want to see like good top ten scores or something in that year, you get this special award.

00:10:15:08 - 00:10:31:07

Katrina Nacci

And if you're with like a big four that give you like $20,000 or something, and I found out that I was one point away from that that year. So I study just like a little bit more maybe I would have gotten. But otherwise, I mean, then starting at here, you see and watching all of my peers have to study while they're working.

00:10:31:07 - 00:10:45:11

Katrina Nacci

It took them like a good sometimes two years to pass all of the sections. So was just really nice to kind of get that out the door. I remember I was going through a couple of different rounds with other companies for that. As soon as I got the pricey offer, I just like this and said, This is why I'm going.

00:10:45:18 - 00:11:11:00

Katrina Nacci

And I was very happy about it. I think I did at some point, maybe like speak to having kind of but interest still in biochemistry, bio physics and like wanting to explore working maybe with like biotechs. And I have been working with a couple of them, but otherwise I don't really remember too much about my interviews. One interesting thing I do remember is that you normally will get interviewed by a partner who went to the same university as you.

00:11:11:00 - 00:11:28:00

Katrina Nacci

It's like part of their recruitment process when they reach out on campus. His name is Rich and funny enough, so he was obviously a partner in Boston in a different group that I didn't even end up joining. So we didn't work together there. But I was sitting in Paris, in Frankfurt one day and I heard them talking about somebody that they were going to bring over as a partner.

00:11:28:02 - 00:11:41:07

Katrina Nacci

It's a comment in Frankfurt and it's at maturity. So I went up to the other partner and I was like, Who are you thinking of? And ended up being rich. So he came out to Frankfurt for a couple of years and I worked with him. You know, we went to the same school. I was just like crazy. You kind of grew the experience.

00:11:43:19 - 00:12:02:01

Daniëlle Keeven

With valuable experience now under her belt where P.W see, it was time for Katrina to slap abroad. As luck would have it, she wanted to be away from BWC for a long. You already heard she was a penal you see in Frankfurt, but you may not know of the interesting culture shock she experienced. What she'll talk about next.

00:12:03:17 - 00:12:19:04

Katrina Nacci

Before I left TWC in Boston, when I sent kind of my goodbye email, one of the quality review partners that I had worked with, Gardini would think he knew my name at the time. You know, it was like a third year associate. He said, Hey, I know a partner in in Frankfurt, if you ever want to reach out, here's this information.

00:12:19:04 - 00:12:44:20

Katrina Nacci

And so I ended up reaching out to him and he was heading up the Capital Markets and Accounting Advisory Group. And that's how I ended up in that space, which turned out to be just a perfect fit for me. And kind of where I've ended up in my career definitely feel like coming home. I mean, there's something about the way that PDC recruits and I guess all of the Big four kind of have their own flavors, but it always feels like no matter where in the world you go, it's just family and you somehow get along really well with them.

00:12:44:20 - 00:13:05:12

Katrina Nacci

I mean, maybe I'm just easy to get along with other people, but I felt the same thing even when I went to Dubai and that I would just like very easy to immediately connect with people. I will say that the one difficult thing about PDC in Germany was just like adapting to the different culture. So I remember showing up on the first day and you know, you start with a huge group of people.

00:13:05:13 - 00:13:27:01

Katrina Nacci

There were there were like 100 or something kind of new joiners or even I wasn't really a new joiner. They called me anyway. The Germans like very muted colors. They wear, you know, black suits, blue suit, that's like just about it. They don't really wear any jewelry. It's like very understated. And so I walked into the auditorium on the first day and it's just like a sea of black and blue suit.

00:13:27:04 - 00:13:42:11

Katrina Nacci

Well, I decide that I'm going to show up. I had a really nice dress and it happened to be p.w see color, which I don't know if you can picture them on the top of your head, but one of the colors, dark pink, spun up in a dark pink dress and I just like, stood out like a sort of like everybody could tell I was not German.

00:13:42:12 - 00:14:03:07

Katrina Nacci

It was definitely tough. Like, I remember being pretty homesick when I first moved over, but it just felt to me like so strongly something that I had to do. And, you know, I remember even being upset when I was going to the airport to leave like my dad, you know, drove me there. And my mom actually flew over with me and we traveled around like three months around Germany before I started working.

00:14:03:07 - 00:14:25:02

Katrina Nacci

But I always kind of took the view that, you know, I'll try it out for a year, see if I like it. It's not. I can always move back. So I always knew that I had now and, you know, ten years later, still over here. So it's obviously worked out. And there have been periods I would say almost every two or three years, a little bit of like an existential crisis comes along, like, do I want to stay with Amy over here?

00:14:25:02 - 00:14:47:12

Katrina Nacci

I enjoy the traveling aspect and just a lot around the culture, but obviously missed my family. Should I move back to the U.S.? But now that I work for myself and can go back and forth a lot easier for work and like have projects in both places, I feel like I finally have that a good balance that obviously I can still see my family a lot, but kind of be able to do my own thing.

00:14:47:12 - 00:15:13:08

Katrina Nacci

I would say like my mom and definitely like I mentioned before, she's more adventurous, willing to travel. She's been over here a couple of times since I moved and my dad and my stepmom are two little more homebodies. So they just came out here for the first time last October and I showed them around. I mean, I think that they they get what I'm doing out here, and especially now that I have this, like, specialized niche, I've really kind of made it my career essentially to be able to go back.

00:15:13:08 - 00:15:17:07

Katrina Nacci

And for us it makes more and more sense to them What I'm doing now.

00:15:20:01 - 00:15:36:10

Daniëlle Keeven

Katrina soon found a niche for herself in cross-border transactional accounting. It's an interesting niche that makes sense with the background you've heard so far. As you'll hear next, there was a point where she could have gone down the CFO path. Pay close attention to why she chose a different route.

00:15:39:21 - 00:16:03:05

Katrina Nacci

When I was working back the PDC in Frankfurt, I mentioned that I was in the capital markets, an accounting advisory team, so I was doing very similar work. But we actually had a specialist team that sat within that that was called the U.S. Topic team, and there were a lot of other American, mostly on the common for a couple years from their home office that were helping to take European companies public in the U.S. or do IFRS U.S. gap conversion.

00:16:03:06 - 00:16:19:01

Katrina Nacci

So I kind of started to get that experience of cross-border and the ten years that I've been over here, I've made a very conscious effort, you know, not knowing if I wanted to go back to the U.S. at some point to always kind of have my hand on the pulse of what's going on in the US and see U.S. accounting reporting space.

00:16:19:01 - 00:16:39:22

Katrina Nacci

And I always just thought it would be really interesting to I mean, I never really considered myself like an entrepreneur, but I always wanted to in the future. And I thought, this is going to be, you know, when I was like 50 years old, think about branching out on my own and having clients on both continents so that I can keep that cross-border niche and continue to dive deeper and deeper into it.

00:16:39:23 - 00:16:58:07

Katrina Nacci

But I ended up so back in 2019, I left the U.S. in Frankfurt and I went into private equity. I was actually working for a Toronto based real estate asset management firm that had just started to buy up assets in Germany. And so they brought me in as the first finance hire to build up the European Accounting reporting function from scratch.

00:16:58:07 - 00:17:17:01

Katrina Nacci

And that was really an awesome experience. I mean, private equity is definitely its own beast in a lot of ways, but I really enjoyed it and we went into a lot of other countries while I was there. So I got to work on a lot of different acquisitions. I mean, the goal of that was partially, Oh, I'm working now for a North America company so I can go back and forth a lot more, all with my bosses.

00:17:17:01 - 00:17:39:03

Katrina Nacci

We're still in Toronto, but then of course Cobar happened and so that really play out and I started to realize the more time I worked in private equity, you know, about promoted to director, the next logical step would have been the CFO. But I realized that that wasn't what I wanted. I mean, CFO sounds like a nice shiny title, but there's a lot that goes along with that around my strategy and of Pioneer, and that just really wasn't my thing.

00:17:39:03 - 00:18:00:03

Katrina Nacci

And I kind of miss the accounting advisory world. So I started to think about again, pivoting back to that, I actually had interviewed with a couple of smaller accounting firms or like advisory firms in the U.S. but when I told them, Hey, how can we make this work to be able to go back and forth between Europe and the U.S., you know, even post-COVID when people work remotely?

00:18:00:03 - 00:18:18:03

Katrina Nacci

And a lot of that aspect is easier from a legal entity perspective if they don't have a legal entity here that can hire me, it doesn't really work. And I guess kind of what really was the cherry on top or that switch that flipped was I was also in a position to get permanent residency here in Germany, so I was able to get that last year.

00:18:18:03 - 00:18:35:16

Katrina Nacci

What allowed me to not have to have a German employment contract in the German entity and I could go on on my own and register as a freelancer and then was able to have a client probably in my pocket because they wanted to hire me and brought me in as a contractor instead. So that was kind of the route that I took initially to bring in clients.

00:18:38:20 - 00:18:53:17

Daniëlle Keeven

Katrina has gained an important understanding of different cultures that allows her to communicate a specific value to her clients that only someone in her position can understand. Listen to her next. Discuss how she communicates the value of cross-border communication.

00:18:55:17 - 00:19:14:06

Katrina Nacci

Even just the way that I think about like writing emails or talking on calls. I think I almost subconsciously now cater the way that I can explain things to if I'm talking to a non-native English speaker. Like when I go home and see my family, they're always like, Why do you talk so weird? You have a strange accent.

00:19:14:06 - 00:19:32:18

Katrina Nacci

I think I just like, accentuate things differently to kind of get my point across. I know it's not really because that's the feedback, but it's really just understanding how to work with different cultures in terms of the ways that they want to be respected. Whether you can show up to a meeting and shake people's hands or not. What are their typical working hours?

00:19:32:18 - 00:19:52:16

Katrina Nacci

Are they going to work on the weekends? Are they going to expect you to work on the weekends? How do they take vacation? All these things, little like nuances. No, you can't really do a lot of business in Europe and especially certain countries like Spain and Italy in August, because the whole country shuts down. A lot of doing things in Germany is still around paperwork and mailing things back and forth.

00:19:52:16 - 00:20:16:11

Katrina Nacci

There's not a lot of electronics, especially when it comes to things around government bureaucracy. So it's just kind of picking up on those little nuances and then kind of being open to different ways of working. I think that again, remote work has probably helped that quite a bit because you don't always have to be sitting face to face with somebody and can be a little bit more thoughtful and like take things back before responding.

00:20:16:11 - 00:20:53:08

Katrina Nacci

And then of course, you know, things like people and translations also come in handy. Yeah, it's just it's almost not so much the specific countries that I've worked in, but just that I have that ability to adapt and kind of be a little bit like a chameleon. And when it comes to like technical accounting stuff, I mean, you could ask me to do something regarding, I don't know, Norwegian Gap or Swedish Gap, and yeah, maybe I haven't been exposed to it before, but because I, confident enough in my research ability, is having had to research and understand different securities regulations, the different accounting policies, like I couldn't go in and say like, yeah, I can

00:20:53:08 - 00:21:19:00

Katrina Nacci

pick that up. It's not that difficult. Like once you learn how to learn about different countries and how they work from a business perspective, it's just a natural skill to develop. I guess there are two different outside secrets. The way that a European CFO would think about that is very different than a U.S. CFO. So for a European CFO, I think maybe it's an unfair advantage, but I have an American accent that automatically gives me more credibility that I know what I'm talking about when it comes to U.S. topics.

00:21:19:00 - 00:21:41:05

Katrina Nacci

But I actually just last week was running a workshop for UK CFOs that are looking to do the U.S. IPO. And just the fact that I can very off the cuff about different topics around like Sarbanes-Oxley and kind of it's a very delicate balance of not overwhelming them with information and open up because I can't different sexy roles and expect them to know what I'm talking about.

00:21:41:05 - 00:22:04:03

Katrina Nacci

But kind of like spoon feed it to them a little bit in a way that they're like, Wow, there's a lot going on here and there's a lot of nuances around going to the U.S. So we need her to help us kind of translate that path forward. And then on the flip side, with U.S. CFOs, it's interesting because the way that the statutory environment exists in the US is different to Europe.

00:22:04:03 - 00:22:39:19

Katrina Nacci

I mean, in the US when you're an entity, maybe you don't have to do a full fledged U.S. gap, but you just have to file with the IRS. And so I wouldn't really call it like a statutory gap. It's more just like going out over a storm like U.S. tax gap, not really to call it. But U.S. officials don't understand that when you acquire entity in Europe, you could take that entity, bring it into your consolidation, do a gap convergent U.S. gap, think you're all fine and dandy to like having your U.S. team take it over, but not understand the specific legalities and some of the nuances around having still that legal entity exists in

00:22:39:19 - 00:22:57:23

Katrina Nacci

Europe. So you know, I know Germany specifically. They need you needing to still keep your books physically in Germany, like on German servers in the German language. I mean, there's ways to get around that. You still have to report under German gap to the tax authorities. There's just like a lot of different things that still have to happen in country.

00:22:57:23 - 00:23:14:09

Katrina Nacci

You can't just like pick up a trial balance, move it into the U.S. and like push your German accounting team off a cliff, basically like you. Still, you need to respect. Basically what I'm getting at is you need to respect the local laws and again, the way of doing business, you're probably still going to have people in country.

00:23:14:09 - 00:23:43:21

Katrina Nacci

And how do they work as compared to how you work? When is their team taking vacation? Just a little like H.R., issues like that. You know, a three month notice period in the U.S. is absolutely mind blowing. But that's the way that things work out here. I think that it's much easier to have those types of conversations with other accounting advisory firms, and that's why I've been going through that at first to get a lot of work, because it's harder to it's like almost knowing what you don't know when it comes to educating other CFOs, and they just don't appreciate that cross-border space as much.

00:23:48:02 - 00:24:03:04

Daniëlle Keeven

While you may typically associated with travel, a first class experience is something Katrina gives to her clients when it comes to cross-border accounting and reporting. Listen to her next. Discuss the value she provides instead of settling for an economy class service.

00:24:05:15 - 00:24:30:20

Katrina Nacci

I really think a lot of that has to do with being able to put on both that hats of being practical and hands on, but also the really strong technical theoretical side. Because when you're thinking about engaging someone for this type of role, you know, typically you're going to have sort of either as an acquisition IP almost generally that would kind of trigger needing to work with a cross-border expert.

00:24:30:23 - 00:24:47:15

Katrina Nacci

And you would typically either try to do that in-house with the staff that you have or you're probably going to look to a big for Big Ten just because that's what you know, and you know that they're going to just like come in and get it done right. But with the big four, a lot of them are Big four for life, so they haven't spent any time in industry.

00:24:47:15 - 00:25:13:22

Katrina Nacci

And so you probably will run into that, especially if you're going through an IPO because you have to deal with like their national office and these people, I mean, they can quote accounting standards to the tee paragraph number y, I mean, super, super smart. But if you haven't spent the time on industry and haven't like rolled up your sleeves to, like have to put a cashflow together yourself or like write memos about a specific transaction, like from the perspective of the company and putting together the journal entries.

00:25:13:22 - 00:25:37:03

Katrina Nacci

ET cetera. You're still going to be kind of theoretical to some extent. And so it's hard to be able to like sitting in hand with a company and like walk them through that process. And on the flip side, somebody who's been in-house probably doesn't necessarily have as strong of like a technical expertise and or if you haven't done a lot internationally, you probably don't have that international experience.

00:25:37:03 - 00:26:01:09

Katrina Nacci

And even just some of the cultural stuff we've been talking about. So I think it's just being able to like blend those together and work as seamlessly as possible even in the background. And I do a lot of stuff, not only remotely obviously, but also more on an async basis. So I tend to rely more on notion pages and teams chats and things where people can pick things up in their own time zone is just something that I've adapted to.

00:26:01:09 - 00:26:24:09

Katrina Nacci

Having to work across different cultures and different time zones so I can really just like slide into the back of your company and kind of let you focus on the day to day and still allow you to be able to make sure that you can complete a transaction on time without the crazy onerous Big four costs, without the kind of back and forth antagonistic relationship that you sometimes get with them and still have the right expertise.

00:26:24:09 - 00:26:33:12

Katrina Nacci

And then also, I mean, the advantage is that your staff start to take out that knowledge as well. Like it's also a training exercise then. So then they can take it forward and run with it.

00:26:36:09 - 00:26:47:12

Daniëlle Keeven

As you've heard, Katrina has the skills and experience it would take to become a CFO herself while she's had opportunities to become one. Listen to Katrina talk about why that isn't the most appealing option.

00:26:50:00 - 00:27:09:06

Katrina Nacci

I see the appeal get like gaining experience in that skill set and becoming a little bit more well-rounded. But it's always I mean, I think a lot of people go through this with their career, like, where do you really decide to, like, dig in to one specific area versus still kind of maintaining that well-rounded aspects of your skills?

00:27:09:06 - 00:27:25:22

Katrina Nacci

I mean, I even had a conversation today with someone, an in-house recruiter that I had talked to a couple of years ago when I was looking for a job. And she kind of kept me in mind was asking if I wanted to help take a German company public in Toronto. But it was meant to be more like a full time CFO thing.

00:27:25:22 - 00:27:40:11

Katrina Nacci

And I kind of I mean, I was very honest about it. Like with that, I don't know that I necessarily want to do like the strategy papers, but I think if you're trying to onboard a new CFO, at the same time you're trying to go public, that person's going to get overwhelmed, trying to do the day to day.

00:27:40:11 - 00:27:55:17

Katrina Nacci

So let me come in still like an interim contractor role, and I can be like the real specialist kind of holding the hands of getting through the IPO. So I still see that, like I'm taking those. If I see a physical opportunity, I'm probably still going to try to have a conversation about it. I don't want to like, exploit the situation.

00:27:55:17 - 00:28:04:20

Katrina Nacci

But again, it comes back to like the education of like what's really possible with the resources that you have where you need to like talk about bringing in experts.

00:28:08:15 - 00:28:21:23

Daniëlle Keeven

Like Katrina has found root for herself abroad. Her career lends itself to opportunities to visit home. Listen to her next. Discuss the newfound appreciation she has for her childhood, as well as imparting wisdom that we could all use.

00:28:23:04 - 00:28:39:13

Katrina Nacci

For the way that I think about my family is almost the same way I think about like Rhode Island in general. If you just give me a minute to explain that. When I was growing up in Rhode Island, the first thought I had was I got to get out of here. And that's why I even in New York freshman year, to go to a different state, I absolutely did not want to live there.

00:28:39:13 - 00:28:58:07

Katrina Nacci

But now that I don't live there and I go back to visit, it makes me appreciate it a lot more. It's very beautiful place. That's great. Towns by the water and it just it makes me look forward to it because it's almost like a special experience from that perspective. It's like going on vacation and not the state that we see.

00:28:58:08 - 00:29:14:12

Katrina Nacci

I only talk to my family when I physically go back there, but it's kind of a it's a similar concept. I mean, I think that they appreciate and understand kind of like, this is Katrina. She's over here doing her own thing, and that makes me a little bit unique. And yeah, I think they have still some difficulty with it.

00:29:14:12 - 00:29:37:03

Katrina Nacci

And of course, would prefer for me to like be closer. But in a lot of ways it's helped the relationship just because they've helped me be able to grow and explore as a person. Now that you know, my parents are divorced, I got divorced when I was in college, but now that I'm more even just like friends with them and have experienced them as like us both being adults and also adds another level in that experience.

00:29:37:03 - 00:29:51:09

Katrina Nacci

And now my brother is a year and a half younger than me. He kind of did the digital nomad remotely and he was just like driving around the country and ended up in Texas. So we're starting to spread out a little bit. I mean, I am I am the oldest sibling. I have two stepsisters as well with our younger.

00:29:51:09 - 00:30:04:01

Katrina Nacci

So I'm sure they'll kind of all start to broaden out and then it'll be a little bit more the norm, you know, with grown adult children that start to have their own kids and things like that. But because I was the first one to do it, I think that made it a little bit more difficult, I would say.

00:30:04:01 - 00:30:25:19

Katrina Nacci

I guess just be patient. I mean, when you're a teenager, everything feels like it's so urgent and stressful and that it's something if one specific thing doesn't happen the way you want it to, that seems like the end of the world. You get more and more experience and kind of more resilient. Realize that you're or at least I am like adaptable when things happen, I can pivot as I need to.

00:30:25:21 - 00:30:28:21

Katrina Nacci

It just makes you realize that you can face whatever is coming at you.

00:30:31:16 - 00:30:55:15

Daniëlle Keeven

Special thanks to Katrina Nnachi for being on the show. You can find her on LinkedIn if you'd like to see things yourself. Know anyone who would be great for the show? Send an email to our senior show producer Ben that Hillman and Padlocks. Also, please leave a five star review if you enjoyed the podcast. We'll see you next time on Beyond the Budget, a podcast from Paddle Studios dedicated to helping you build better SaaS.